It was great for us, because being in the UK, we couldn't hear those radio shows live. We'd be buying dubs of tapes from guys we knew in NYC, trying to get hold of these things. And, yeah, Bobbito put it out and I think it was even bootlegged almost instantly - there just weren't enough copies to meet the demand over here. That Cenobites EP was a milestone in terms of the independent hip-hop scene. I think it showed that there were people listening to what the fans wanted for once and you could put records out of this material... and I reckon that paved the way for a lot of other great records at the time. Right. And I was definitely aware that something was happening - a shifting in the pool, so to speak, of the things that were previously set artistically and creatively. I knew we were onto something - I knew Keith was always onto something - but it was like-minds just hooking up and getting influenced by each other. It was limitless! If we'd had more time, more grilled cheese sandwiches... we probably woulda did all sorts of stuff, because it was fun to us! It really was, at that time, so much fun. I'm sure if anyone asked Keith about it he'd say the same thing: it was fun or it was bugged out. That definitely came across in the tracks, I think. You could tell you guys were having fun and there was a really good chemistry together. Yeah - I learned a lot from Keith, as far as being a performer on records and things like that. There's a few things I have with him on them too that never got heard from that era. For us to have been part of the process to get things like '7 Degrees Of Elevation' out on vinyl is an honour! These are tracks that people have talked about for a long time, so to have finally got that out on wax is pretty incredible: we're really lucky to have had the opportunity to do this with you. That's nice! That's crazy man... I guess it's like how I used to feel when I heard Bob playing something that we'd recorded. We'd be calling each other up like, 'Yo! Listen! They're playing 'Kick A Dope Verse'!' 'They're playing *that*?!'. I'd be calling Bob up, 'Yo, what are you doing?!' and he'd be like, 'This is hot! You've gotta be one of the most humble guys in hip-hop that I've ever spoken to, seriously! I get told that sometimes! I don't know! It's just that I love music and art so much that it's never enough, as far as appreciating it... I'm a speck of dust in the spectrum of creativity.
			So after the Cenobites stuff, you hooked up with Hydra... I was walking up 8th Avenue, with Menelik, and we ran into Keith. And they were selling something out of a car trunk, some records... and there I met Tim Dog, who impressed me - just his presence, y'know? And at that same moment, across the street, was Jerry, the owner of Hydra. Or maybe not Jerry... maybe his A&R guy at the time, Mike Heron. So we got talking and the next thing I went up to see the guys at Hydra - Screwball was there - and we were talkin' and I said 'Alright, I'll bring some things by'. It took a little while and it took a *lot* of demos, but for the 'Diabolique' album we finally we hit upon some tunes that we all liked - and that was that. And when it came time to do another album I made a lot of tapes and stuff and it was not 'Diabolique'. For them to like 'Diabolique' was hard enough, in my opinion. I give them credit. What I was doing after that, I don't blame them at all. Hmmm... yeah, but on the other hand, sure that's you evolving as an artist. Isn't part of the label's responsibility to support you creatively where possible? Yeah, but that's risky business. Our MO was always to make stuff, whether it was with Keith or the guys from the neighbourhood or whoever, that we'd play back and be like, 'Oh man! Let me borrow that!' and pass two tapes around the block. That's nice. 'Yo, you got a copy of that?!'. That's what we always wanted to go for: the quality where you just gotta get a copy! I know what you're saying... I remember hearing 'Styles By The Gram' for the first time. There was a major shop for us in London to pick up what the latest records, 'Mr. Bongo', and I remember going in one Saturday and they were playing 'Styles...' - and people were just lining up to get that 12". Wow... I've heard things to that effect before, when I was doing an interview with a Japanese magazine one time. 'Styles By The Gram' was one of four or five songs I was working on to try and get a single together - and 'Styles By The Gram' was the one that I had the most heart in. The other ones I felt that I was just trying to make a single, y'know? That was that time in hip-hop where people were saying, 'Yo, that doesn't sound like a single'... When that track comes in with the sinister loop... Oh man! Yeah, that's very creepy! That's what I liked about that - when it first comes on you have a chill up your spine. Have you ever heard a track I did with Menelik... called... oh man, I can't even remember! It was a single that Menelik put out from his 'Seven Eyes Seven Horns' album... It uses the music from 'Serpico'... Ahhh.. 'Special FX'? Yes! That's the one. I really liked that - that's one of the verses that I really liked that I did at the time. So that would've been '98... 98? Wow... wow! So, after Hydra... well, during Hydra but not putting anything out, I was just recording a lot and doing a lot of stuff with Menelik. He was ready at that time to work with me. We did a whole bunch of promos and stuff, but at that time... The whole Bobbito thing was morphing into something else and the whole scene started to change and everybody thought they could do it now... all the rhyming started getting ridiculous and cartoony. And I was like, 'Naah - this wasn't my intention'... not that I started anything, but it's a cyclic thing: you give, it gives back, you give, it gives back...
	See... we knew that you were a classically trained musician, in that you can play the guitar and everything. Turning to the back of the 'Hazardous' album, we see you with your guitar case - and then you read the credits and see that you did a hell of a lot of stuff on there. Yeah man. Sometimes I look at that album and think what was Select's involvement with that album?! I mean I never got *paid* for it, but I'd never been in a studio before. That was my first time and if I did it again, I'd probably do it all differently. The way that album was recorded... you'd laugh! And that was my fault: not to take anything from anybody else. But I didn't have a hip-hop engineer, believe it or not: they gave me a rock engineer. Greg Gordon? Yes, Greg Gordon. Ahhh... on the album's title track, 'Hazardous', you shout out 'Greg, Greg and another Greg!'... Haha! Yeah... Greg Riles - he was the A&R at Select - and there was another Greg who wanted to be my manager at that time - and Greg Gordon. So, Greg, Greg and another Greg! What was it about shout-outs?! It was the new thing! If you listen to my album shout-outs wasn't a big part of my thing! But after a while everyone was doing it - half the record was shout outs at the height of that craze, man! That's one of the things we'd study though! We'd flip to the back of the cover and read, 'Yo, he's shouting out Boostin Kev...' Oh? You know about Kev? Yeah, definitely. There's definitely a few people out here that like his music... You got 'I'm a Booster'? Yeah! And 'Dunt Da Dunt Dunt'! Oh man! This is... wow! That's good man, the memory of Kev will be OK, man... I met Kev through the same guy that I met Kool Keith. Kev and Keith knew each other too, not musically, but like fellas, y'know? And the same thing: when me and Kev met, we hit it off. Me and Kev, in the late 80s, before 'Hazardous', we did block parties together. We used to tape things off and he was doing the turntables... I have a demo, I don't know if I still have it, me and his first demo. I'm rhyming and he's doing all the production - I'm not doing any music on it. That was during my Big Daddy Kane, Biz phase! That was an old phase! That's pre-'Hazardous' - that's hilarious to listen to now... When I started getting aware lyrically and finding my own voice, to me it seems like it came like a light one day - POOOMP! - a light came on! Before then, all I knew was Kane, Chuck D and KRS One. Those were my three influences. I didn't even want to start rapping - a friend of mine named Seek, he wanted me to rap. He was like, 'Yo, you should do this...' because I used to do his music in the 80s, because I played instruments. He was like, 'Yo, why don't you do it - it's not so hard!'. Alright, I'll try it! And then that was it! Well, you have a natural ability for it. You're like king of syllables! That was my thing! I wanted to raise the bar, so people couldn't fake it! Make something to really shoot for and build upon and take it to the next level. I was really into that: I used to have a clique called the Syllable Checkers and when new records came out we used to start checkin' everybody's syllables! We used to have all types of theological discussions on the art of putting things together!